| Author |
Message
|
| Taellinu |
 Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:28 am Post subject: Emotion....necessary? |
 |
|
Joined: 06 Sep 2008
Posts: 1336
Location: In the American midwest
|
this came up in RP and I thought i'd sahre it and get all yoru thoughts on it...I think I make mine clear with the post. But I'm wondering ifi'm actually right about some of that, I swear sometimes I blur the IC OOC line so much that is messes with me, this is one of those times.
Adagio: would raise a cold eyebrow and she’d speak with her normally icy tone." (DELETED) I would have to agree with you but sometimes people are incapable of feeling and sometimes those people are needed. I know that I don't exactly feel anything. I don't know why but I would seem to be like Aylin in that respect, but I am not detached. I hate to say it (DELETED) but with the work Ashagi does that detachment that they have is needed. Sometimes in order to progress horrible acts must be committed, I know that doesn’t justify it, nothing can (DELETED), but it happens and is needed." She would end the statement quite coldly. "I have the same detachment towards my work, if I need to defend a member of the corporation I’ll apply what ever force is required, if I had to defend you against someone I would. Even if that meant ripping their arm off I’d do it and I wouldn't feel anything." She would let out a sigh..."Sometimes emotion DOES get in the way. Same for compassion, but you're right, people aren't animals.
_________________
Always try to make a good impression on the people you meet. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
| Toir |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 12:58 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 24 Jan 2008
Posts: 10
|
| I would say that someone who feels no emotion at all would be mentally ill. I'm not cetrain they would be a sociopath as that usually means a person has a total lack of empathy for others. Maybe something worse, but I don't have the exact word for it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Nocens |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 19 Sep 2008
Posts: 229
|
Considering Nocens is a cyberpsychotic and has severe empathy issues I thought I'd tackle this a bit.
Lacking empathy doesn't necassarily make you mentally ill, however it could make you a sociopath in some instances, considering how you RP it. Going beyond that, you could almost look at it like autism, a firm detachment in some cases. For instance, Nocens has a detachment to humanity because so much of his body and brain have been cybernetically augmented; he has lost the ability to empathize with humans on an emotional level...and when he tries he loses control of himself and normally lashes out like a child (ask anyone who has tried to even touch him in a nice way...he can't process the emotion and just freaks out). I'm not going to repeat a bunch of junk, but if you want to read about Noc's particular psychology (for your own fun, I guess) you can do so here: http://midiancity.wikia.com/wiki/Nocens#Cyberpsychosis
Going further than that you could categorize yourself as suffering from alexithymia, which is a state of deficiency in understanding, processing, or describing emotions.
Adagio's situation, however, is that she was actually artificially created. Here you can look at it from a replicant perspective. Programmed to respond a certain way to your external environment but incapable of processing the actual emotional aspects of it. You know how to react but you don't necassarily 'feel' anything because you are incapable of it. Or you can shut it off.
Or, quite frankly, you just don't care.
_________________
I'm a walking nightmare, an arsenal of doom...I kill conversation as I walk into the room...I'm a three line whip, I'm the sort of thing they ban...I'm a walking disaster
(Sell crazy some place else, we're all stocked up here.) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Toir |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 24 Jan 2008
Posts: 10
|
| Not caring about anything could be described as apathy. I believe there was a recent study that showed people that lacked emotional stimulus took a great deal longer processing any decisions. Not feeling one way or another they just sat and stared off into space trying to figure out just what to do anf failing that, they did nothing. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Nocens |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 19 Sep 2008
Posts: 229
|
Speaking from experience in the field, what you are describing Toir could also be city and government workers.
"Yes, um I have a question about.."
"Please hold."
20 minutes later "How may I help you?"
"I have a question about my account, could you."
"Transfering."
"Ok, um, thanks."
"Please hold."
"Fuck...okay."
20 minutes later "How may I help you?"
"I have this question about my account."
"You should've called Accounts, let me get the number."
"No no, I already called them and they transfered me to you."
"Well that isn't right....hold on...transfering."
"Dammit..."
"We're sorry, but our offices are now closed, please call back tomorrow between 10am and 1pm. (City workers snickering in the background)."
_________________
I'm a walking nightmare, an arsenal of doom...I kill conversation as I walk into the room...I'm a three line whip, I'm the sort of thing they ban...I'm a walking disaster
(Sell crazy some place else, we're all stocked up here.) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| DamienKiranov |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 2:43 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 240
Location: The Batcave, the Justice League Satellite, Avenger HQ, or SHIELD Command Center, take your pick.
|
I have to say that some emotion is required. I play DK as having it, but not fully understanding it. Particularly empathy and guilt, since those two emotions are almost completely foreign to him. Fortunately, he has someone to act as his little conscience for most things, so he's at least compensated.
The other way to look at it, is like Taladis. Someone who has, for the most part, just one default expression. Grumpy.
It gets increasingly hard to keep a character interesting when he is, for the most part, a one-trick, or in this case, a one-sided, one-emotion pony.
_________________
And then... with all his divine might... Great Obama said... Let there be change! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Toir |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:05 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 24 Jan 2008
Posts: 10
|
| Nocens wrote: |
| Speaking from experience in the field, what you are describing Toir could also be city and government workers. |
Actually that is apathy mixed with laziness. They get paid whether or not they help you. It was the same under the Soviet factory system or Mao's collective farms. It didn't matter who did the work as long as it was done, you would be 'paid' regardless if only 10 out of 100 people did all the work while 90 people lounged. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Fenris Skall |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
Posts: 643
|
Emotion is a general scope. To say someone has proffessional detachment dosn't make them mentally Ill.
For example the logical choice may not be the moralistic one.
Logic over morals. You can still have emotions and yet make the "rational" choice despite any emotional or moral conflict you have.
Usually those who are extremely passionate about their cause will just prioritise goals.
Does this reach the goal? Yes? do it!
Does this reach the goal and yet is a nasty thing to do to someone? Yes. Do It any how as the greater cause is more important.
An emotional stimulus of some kind is required for decision making. Those that are passionate about a cause of any kind are more likely to go all out to persue it.
Those lacking emotions at all, have no stimilus to persue anything at all.
Passion is more deadly than total detachment. You can't be driven by detachment. You have to be driven by passion.
You can however be detached from anything that dosn't fall with in the bounds of your passion.
For example , my characters passion is the enviorment and he would if the situation presented itself , have 3/4ths of humanity slaughtered to ease the strain upon it.
The same detachment towards humans, as most humans have towards nature.
So I would say to actually get shit done, one needs a passion, one can't have a passion with out emotions.
Because you have emotions, dosn't mean however you can't control them.
You can control fear, anger, externally to prevent you making illogical choices, however those two things probablly will overall drive your character in one direction or the other.
Anger at injustice, fear of the future.
If you have no emotions at all, then you only have survival insticts.
which would prevent you entering 99.9 percent rp.
Why are you avenging this person? You have no emotional attachment to them.
At best an emotionaless person is a drone.
A drone would need a list of priorities, directives if you will.
They've got no reason to do something unless it's a directive.
Emotion also allows our characters imaginations. If you can't empathise with someone, how do you know what the best way to fuck them up is?
You have to be able to feel empathy, to know how to make people suffer.
One glove dosn't fit all. Best way to destroy an enemy is to know the enemy. That means on an emphatic level. What works on you, dosn't work on them persay, you have to walk a mile in their shoes.
With out empathy, this is not possible.
So depending on your goals. Emotion is neccessiry. remember you can control them to a degree, having a character with emotions dosn't make them -emotional-
_________________
These are opinions. I'll remain impersonal and unsarcastic so long as you do. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| David Valentino |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 5:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 16 Apr 2009
Posts: 111
|
I believe you can function fine, though perhaps very coldly, but still lack most emotions, or all of them to any strong degree. You can understand emotion, you can see it in others, you can follow the logical course as to it's cause, but perhaps not feel it for yourself.
Logic would dictate that you take actions for your survival. It would also dictate that you try and understand what is going on around you. The choice to "avenge" someone could be a survival tactic, or even a business decision. "Can't let them get away with that, or they will try it on me next."
Many sociopaths function just fine in our society, some rising to great heights no doubt. They don't have empathy, they don't feel remorse or guilt, but they do have goals, and have been taught the societies rights and wrongs. They know what actions cause what consequences. They understand how to manipulate emotional responses in others, and they don't miss a second of peaceful sleep after doing things that cause many folks grief. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Tril Prieto |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 7:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
Posts: 57
|
I think any created being intended to have contact with people would at the very least have to have emotional intelligence.
Otherwise you'd have someone constantly missing basic social cues and would seem very "off" to others with a more typical emotional make-up.
But emotional intelligence doesn't mean empathy (con artists typically have very strong emotional intelligence, it's how they get people to fall for the con). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| AlegriaDagostino |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 7:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Posts: 637
Location: Mostly MPD. Chasing the Creepies. You know who you are.
|
Hmm...so many interesting thoughts on this matter...
First, I need to address the mention of autism as it relates to this question. I have a 6 year old autistic son, and a 5 year old son with sensory disfunction tendencies. I can assure you without any doubt that autists are not detached for LACK of emotion. The detachment that someone with a disorder on the autism spectrum appears to display is rather due to an OVERLOAD of emotion. Consider for a moment that you are surrounded by stimuli that to most people is average, not overwhelming at all. But due to your autism condition, each of those stimulating items is tenfold over what a normal person feels. Compound them, and you are confronted with just too much...period. So, as a defense mechanism, your brain shuts you down against most, if not all of it, depending on the severity of your autism.
Take for example a child's birthday party. Half a dozen preschoolers, a dozen parents, balloons, streamers, music, talking, laughing. And in the corner, one child, alone, perhaps rocking back and forth, quietly playing with something. Immediate reaction? Perhaps that he is disinterested. Aloof, detached child. Most assume he is without the emotion necessary to perhaps 'care' what is going on around him. Quite the opposite, as I can tell you that hours later when the celebration is over, that little boy falls apart. Meltdown central. "Where is everyone? Are all those people coming back to see me? Is there another party tomorrow?" (Yes, I'm lucky in that my autistic son has had the best teachers anywhere to help him learn to communicate effectively.) What I learned from that day, and the next, when my son's sorrowful questions continued, is that the emotions existed, were in full swing, but were just too much for him to interact and display with so much going on around him.
SO I submit to this discussion that what may often appear as an absence of emotion, even to ones' self, could very well be an overload of feeling, and the detachment comes from simply lacking the mechanism to be able to process and handle them in a socially acceptable way. Autistic, or not.
Lack of displayed emotion also comes from necessity. Regardless of what people may say, I would wager that many times, the emotion exists, but for any array of reasons, cannot be displayed. Could be a professional reason, could be personal, could be out of safety or to protect oneself emotionally, mentally, even physically.
I agree with Fenris' assessment that passion drives people. SO that even those who appear to be emotionless must indeed possess enough of it to drive them to do whatever it is that they do.
I also submit to this discussion that a great many people are horribly detached from their own emotions to the point that they may believe themselves without it.
Haha...speaking of said son of mine...I'll have to finish this later 
_________________
"The worst kind of evil is the evil that thinks it is good." - Collin Matthews
Al Dagostino, MPD Chief
http://alsmidian.blogspot.com
Flickr! http://flickr.com/photos/27720020@N05/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Rin Tae |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 8:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 511
Location: around town
|
| Quote: |
I think any created being intended to have contact with people would at the very least have to have emotional intelligence.
Otherwise you'd have someone constantly missing basic social cues and would seem very "off" to others with a more typical emotional make-up.
|
Actually I have played such a being in RP (and still do, but not in Midian) and even when it is very difficult, it is a very revarding challenge. It can be funny or makes the character seem creepy at the same time and it definitevly shapes the character and it's interaction with other people in ways, that are totally different, then 'normal' emotional reactions would.
Of course, the 'offness' in this case comes from a different, not human, logic being behind my characters actions, but the general idea goes into the same direction. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Taellinu |
| Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2009 9:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 06 Sep 2008
Posts: 1336
Location: In the American midwest
|
| David Valentino wrote: |
I believe you can function fine, though perhaps very coldly, but still lack most emotions, or all of them to any strong degree. You can understand emotion, you can see it in others, you can follow the logical course as to it's cause, but perhaps not feel it for yourself.
|
This would actually be the approach I've taken with Adagio. She's very cold, and rarely experesses anything more than a raised eyebrow and she never lets emotion color her voice, yet she posesses it and it affects her to a slight degree. I'd honestly compare Adagio to a vulcan, however...hmm i guess that works.
_________________
Always try to make a good impression on the people you meet. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Stephan Nephilim |
| Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 1:55 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 515
Location: Ashagi Laboratories - Midian City
|
Speaking as someone who was diagnosed with autism as a child and young teenager, I can say it's entirely possible to believe and act like you have no emotions. Especially when the only emotions you understand are calm serenity and confused panic. It becomes a viscious cycle of when you panic, you want to control and repress our emotions more, which leads to worse panic attacks and confusion.
And given pure sciences are one of those things that can engross the mind and bring serenity, I can imagine Adagio being skilled at repressing her feelings.
But if you want to be realistic, in my opinion, the emotions have to come out eventually, in negative and destructive ways as she might not have developed the tools for understanding or dealing with her own feelings.
_________________
Ston (Gaston Khandr) - Hounds
Stephan Frontenac - Unemployed Rich Guy
Stephan's Diary -> http://flickr.com/photos/29674679@N03/ |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Taellinu |
| Posted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 4:09 am Post subject: |
|
|
Joined: 06 Sep 2008
Posts: 1336
Location: In the American midwest
|
| Stephan Nephilim wrote: |
And given pure sciences are one of those things that can engross the mind and bring serenity, I can imagine Adagio being skilled at repressing her feelings.
But if you want to be realistic, in my opinion, the emotions have to come out eventually, in negative and destructive ways as she might not have developed the tools for understanding or dealing with her own feelings. |
Hhehehe you're right, and she expresses her emotion in carefully moderated and restrained measures. But I can imagine that the first time she is attacked, if she wins the nsuing fight I imagine It won't be good for who ever she has on the ground.
Funny thing is she called Aylin emotional the other day, so how she'll develop is going to be interesting. currently I have her slowly learning to express herself, but i'll see what happens.
_________________
Always try to make a good impression on the people you meet. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
|
