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| Vampire scents for the sensitive noses among us |
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| Masha Eilde |
 Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:39 pm Post subject: Vampire scents for the sensitive noses among us |
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Inspired by the recent thread on Vampires and the masquerade in Midian, I'd love to get agreement from the vampire faction on how scents work for Midian vampires.
Masha is a coyote hybrid and scent is her first sense these days, primary even before sight although of course vision is a very close second.
Whenever I see a titler that says scent masked, and if Masha has a reason to be taking in their scent, I make sure to stick to that or to IM the player. But Masha is one of the folks who unequivocally knows about the presence of vampires in Midian. She was Sarcina under O, she knows Ixion and Fu and has seen Bones in action. She also knows to generally not talk about it.
What that led to was when I saw a vampire without a titler noting a masked scent, I would IM them to find out what, if anything Masha might scent. I've been RPing her scent sense as another language almost, with associations of color/tone and other adjectives to her "scent library". The folks I IM'd would use words/phrases like the following:
metallic (iron), musty, like dead moths, old linen, like snakes
I've sort of tagged them as a "base" vampire scent - not the individual vampire's base scent mind you, but akin to "dog" or "human" or what have you in category.
Last night, however, I ran into a vampire who said that vamps have no scent, that they simply absorb what's closest to them.
So now I'd like to get the final word from y'all so I can RP it appropriately! A "no scent" might frankly raise a bigger red flag then "different scent" because to a canine nose, everything has a scent, or at least that's my understanding? If I'm wrong, feel free to say 
Cheers!
-M
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| Aegyptia Elvehjem |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:06 pm Post subject: |
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Do you use words like: 'metallic (iron), musty, like dead moths, old linen, like snakes' to describe a human, feline or canine scent? Or do you just say they smell human, etc? It would be sorta like saying cats smell like pee, lol, not very becoming and I bet most cats would hate if you decided they smelled like that, though I know this is others telling you how they smell.
I dunno about other vamps, but I am not real happy about being categorized by any of those scents and going with a 'human' scent would make more sense considering the masquerade, as otherwise, all smell sensitive creatures would know vamps by smell immediately. That 'power' is oft abused and I imagine led to the rampent smell titlers we have in existence today.
To say they smell like the grave, that might be better, like fresh tilled earth, but this 'dead scent' thing I would think would be incorrect. Vampires are 'undead', the thing that causes a scent of death is decomposure, which does not happen with a vampire at all, they are not alive, they are not dead either, they are 'undead' which is something wholly different. The flesh is not decomposing but rather in a state of regenerative stasis.
Pera smells like vanilla coffee beans because she sleeps in coffee to mask any other scents for many reasons, but mainly Chi and the fact she hates light. This can be easily explained as she may spill coffee on herself serving peeps at Bangkok or drinking it herself. I would imagine each vampire is different though and the only reason they may smell like fresh tilled soil is if they slept in it. Perfume, as well, isn't rocket science and was invented long ago, so people scenting themselves is not really very unusual.
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Last edited by Aegyptia Elvehjem on Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:37 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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| Masha Eilde |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:19 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks, Pera!
Actually, because scent is so difficult to describe, I've been using words and phrases just like the examples I listed that were provided by other players RPing vamps! Otherwise, I'd just say vampires smell like, well, vampires.
As to abuse, just like anything else with free-form RP, scent can be godmodded. But I'm asking this question in order to see if there's a consistent ruling among the Nightbreed faction, and if not, what sort of guidelines they'd like.
Like any other power, IMing first is always a good idea, at least that's how I do it with Masha. Ultimately, the other player wins - if s/he wants to say they smell like jellybeans, who am I to argue?
Hope to hear from more folks who play vamps!
Cheers!
-M
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| Rejeanne Cannoli |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 08 Jul 2007
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but vampires don't breathe (although they may move their chests to simulate breathing) and they don't perspire. Or have any of the other bodily functions that we'll leave unsaid but would also affect an individual's scent to a sensitive nose. And those scents would be very distinctive, changing not only according to the individual's last meal, but also affected by stress levels, blood chemistry, pheromone production, and how recently they changed their socks. All of these would give an individual a distinct "living" component to their scent that vampires just would not have. (A vampire who smelled too much of THEIR last meal would also be sending out pretty clear signals that would at lease arouse some curiosity.)
Frankly, to someone with a better-than-human nose, anyone who smelled TOO much like coffee beans, or air freshener, or the leather interior of a new Mercedes, is *obviously* hiding something. Simplest explanation, *to someone who already knows about vampires* is, "Here's another vampire.". Ditto if they smelled like nothing at all.
Here's another perspective: Suppose a crime was committed, and arriving upon the crime scene, investigators find a scrap of clothing. Believing it to belong to the perpetrator, it is given to an individual with a better-than-human nose, to try and get an identifying scent. If the scrap belonged to a vampire, what scent would be detected? What would NOT be detected?
I would expect that the scrap would NOT smell like it had been worn by a living person (at least, not recently). To someone who already knew about vampires, that would be a meaningful clue.
Even if they don't believe in vampires, anyone with a sensitive nose in Midian should at LEAST become aware over time that there are a group of people who don't smell 'right'. Those people are often pale-complexioned, and perhaps there are other things that this group has in common that would become obvious over time. |
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| Chandra Meehan |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Aegyptia Elvehjem wrote: |
| To say they smell like the grave, that might be better, like fresh tilled earth, but this 'dead scent' thing I would think would be incorrect. Vampires are 'undead', the thing that causes a scent of death is decomposure, which does not happen with a vampire at all, they are not alive, they are not dead either, they are 'undead' which is something wholly different. The flesh is not decomposing but rather in a state of regenerative stasis. |
Thanks Pera! Couldn't have described it any better!!! Besides one thing to remember... these days the vampires don't sleep in graves and digg in and out there each night... they live in apoc appartments, and yes, they even take showers I hear... *laughs* and it really should be the vampire telling the 'sniffer' what they smell like and not the one sniffing 'assuming they smell vampire', after all the vamp will know what they last did!!!
| Masha Eilde wrote: |
| As to abuse, just like anything else with free-form RP, scent can be godmodded. But I'm asking this question in order to see if there's a consistent ruling among the Nightbreed faction, and if not, what sort of guidelines they'd like. |
So far there was no 'rule' yet, but you observed it right, the increase of titlers WAS the result of people claiming they smell vampire without even asking in IMs. So along with the players that come and go, there were a few things that were obviously different in the past, which lead to what we have today.
Anyway... The term 'freeform RP' doesn't mean 'absence of rules', so with that, we still have the mask as a simrule for vampires and thinking reasonably, that also means 'no auto-smelling of vampires'.
| Masha Eilde wrote: |
Like any other power, IMing first is always a good idea, at least that's how I do it with Masha. Ultimately, the other player wins - if s/he wants to say they smell like jellybeans, who am I to argue?
Hope to hear from more folks who play vamps! |
Right. Just always keep in mind, new vampire players in the sim need as well our help and assistance, and as long as the vampire is not approved and been around a bit, you should look extra careful at what you sniff or not. Same as with other characters, they also need some time of orientation in the sim to figure out how things work - hence why we'd like to encourage NOT starting out straight away with a vampire.
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| Chandra Meehan |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Rejeanne Cannoli wrote: |
| I would expect that the scrap would NOT smell like it had been worn by a living person (at least, not recently). To someone who already knew about vampires, that would be a meaningful clue. |
Could be also a biomech.
| Rejeanne Cannoli wrote: |
| Those people are often pale-complexioned, and perhaps there are other things that this group has in common that would become obvious over time. |
They are as 'pale' as everybody else in a city with poluted intoxicated sky. But anyway. I am very pale IRL but not a vampire... so really that simply doesn't count as 'proof', paleness is both connected to heritage, origin of country, or simply a fashion-trend that everybody can have if they want. (well unless they are clearly darkskinned as in African, Indian, .....)
So please... only because it is convenient to use the 'oocly obvious vampire explaination', come up with something creative, and as well give the vampire the chance to explain themselves and not come up with /me thinks the one is a vampire but smiles and says nothing. That is kinda un-cool cause it leaves no ways to react either.
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| rena mayne |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 26 Jun 2007
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| Chandra Meehan wrote: |
| Rejeanne Cannoli wrote: |
| Those people are often pale-complexioned, and perhaps there are other things that this group has in common that would become obvious over time. |
They are as 'pale' as everybody else in a city with poluted intoxicated sky. But anyway. I am very pale IRL but not a vampire... so really that simply doesn't count as 'proof', paleness is both connected to heritage, origin of country, or simply a fashion-trend that everybody can have if they want. (well unless they are clearly darkskinned as in African, Indian, .....)
So please... only because it is convenient to use the 'oocly obvious vampire explaination', come up with something creative, and as well give the vampire the chance to explain themselves and not come up with /me thinks the one is a vampire but smiles and says nothing. That is kinda un-cool cause it leaves no ways to react either. |
From OOC observation, the vamps in Midian ain't so pale. In fact, many have that, fresh from the Bahama's glow!
OOCly points to Jake, Ix and Artika. I think they've been hitting the spray on tanner. ;)
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| Marina Storaro |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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Okee I just want to chime in here too, even though it's been said a number of places in different ways, but it bears reiterating:
Just because someone hangs around a vampire your char "knows" icly is a vampire, isn't a clue they are. It really shouldn't be --- and is a piece of why metagaming is tricky, because a lot of the time it's unintentional (i.e. we know oocly there's a pattern, so we think, ok, well icly I'd be able to figure it out). But someone hanging with a vampire, say, Nenraa, whom Masha doesn't know is a vamp (just example here, hehe) emerges from the crypt with Ixion (who Masha does know is a vamp). Well hell. She could be a ghoul, she could be someone he just fed on, she could be a nifty vampy-slave of sorts. Or she could just be some human hanging out with a vamp who doesn't have a clue.
Masha's in twwwuuuuubble too.. *coff coff* ... you know why!!  |
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| Chandra Meehan |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Marina Storaro wrote: |
| But someone hanging with a vampire, say, Nenraa, whom Masha doesn't know is a vamp (just example here, hehe) emerges from the crypt with Ixion (who Masha does know is a vamp). Well hell. She could be a ghoul, she could be someone he just fed on, she could be a nifty vampy-slave of sorts. Or she could just be some human hanging out with a vamp who doesn't have a clue. |
You know who I had all coming out of the crypt already with Chandra??? Alegria, Craven, Damian, Marina, a ton of more-or-less-unknown mortal dinners, Roxyann, Angela, Amaya, hmmm... let me think.. OMG they are SO many that I don't even remember htem all... none of them was a vampire. ;-P
So if somebody were to 'investigate' IC about the Society, they would also find reasonable explainations IC. Cause we DO have them!!!
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| Atmlady Alcott |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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Can't I just keep on believing they don't exist and leave it like that? 
Of course, IF I am ever seen with a title above saying "smells like fresh vanilla and chocolate chip cookies you might take a second look 
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| Masha Eilde |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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::pokes tongue out at Marina:: It's not her fault! Well, mostly? :p
Okay, so I"m hearing that there's no real base scent for vampires, that we just continue as is, IMing to see what the player wishes?
To clarify with the kitty Ms. Pera brought up Everyone has a basic idea what a cat smells like, even though they vary based on individuals, strays and domestic, what they've been doing, all that stuff. But you can say "he smells like a cat" and folks know what you mean.
I'm trying to learn if there's something similar for the Midian vampires.
Cheers!
-M
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| Chandra Meehan |
| Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Masha Eilde wrote: |
| Okay, so I"m hearing that there's not real base scent for vampires, that we just continue as is, IMing to see what the player wishes? |
That's the way I handle it, cause I would know what my character last did.
Plus in all fairness and as mean as it sounds: if somebody consistently tries to force on me that they can smell my vampire, know everything about vampires and what so not, then I will simply avoid playing with them. I am not having fun with 'oh I know what you are' so same as with the rapists that search for 'their' RP and avoid super-heros, I simply walk on.
So yeah... for me just in general, my opinion is pretty straight forward: if somebody wants to play with vampires, then they should also respect their rules and their understanding of 'freeform RP fun'. there is no point in wanting to play with any of us and at the same time declaring they know everything and are immune to all vampire powers. Just my two cents on that... It insanely spoils our fun as well.
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| Artika |
| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 2:46 am Post subject: |
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| rena mayne wrote: |
From OOC observation, the vamps in Midian ain't so pale. In fact, many have that, fresh from the Bahama's glow!
OOCly points to Jake, Ix and Artika. I think they've been hitting the spray on tanner. ;) |
*laughs and admits to her guilt* Actually, Artika is from Indonesia, growing up in Jakarta, and her lovely tan is just her natural skin pigment, not the result of any spray on tans... (or more accurately the makers of Vivant chestnut skins haha))
As for scents, when I was new I usually had 'frangipani scent' in the titler, which is from traditional stories in Indonesia about a creature similar to a vampire. After a while, though, I realized that it was just potentially alerting players that she is a vampire - and I stopped wearing that title just as I usually wear the art gallery group title rather than nightbreed. It shouldn't make a difference in the way other characters react to you, but with a significant percentage I'm convinced that it does LOL. My understanding is fairly similar to what some others have already said, that a vampire would have a fairly neutral scent, not an 'alive' scent but not smelling of decay either. On top of that, they can use any other scents that they have IC access to. |
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| Charles Noble |
| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 5:49 am Post subject: |
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SCENT
Well its not what vampires smell of
but what they don't smell of
they don't smell of
pheromones
sweat
fresh carbon dioxide..
stale carbon dioxide from the air is different from fresh carbon dioxide generated by a pair of functioning lungs as vampires only pretend to breathe and don't actually breath a keen nose would detect that.If it knew to flag that.
A biomech the same cept probablly smells of more mechanical smells in adition.. grease, oil, you know the sort and if you have keen smell due to some canine influence its likely you also have keen hearing too.
SOUND
if you are in a quite enough place you might notice the absence of heat beat and actual sound of breath exhalation.
As they don't actually breathe or exhale their voice can only carry on the air in front of them or in their mouths. Probablly has that same "strained" quality to it as an asthmatic would but with out the wheeze or rasp.
NORMAL OBSERVATION
In cold places you might notice that some people leave breath vapor on the air and others dont. (the flush of life only makes the heart beat and the cheast rise and fall it can not however stimulate breath, and even if it did a vampire could not stand outside on a cold day trying to pass for human very long with out passing out from blood loss, the flush of life requires blood expenditure))
Failing that give someone you suspect of being a vampire a birthday cake on their birthday and ask them to blow the candle out....HAHAHAHHAHA
course a bigger clue might be the number of candles on the cake.
Hand over an Ice cold beer to a someone and watch the glass for any mist that appears on touch. They have no body heat ergo they remain the same temprature as room around them.
Cold hand skin or hand shake.
though of course some vampires mask this coldness by pumping blood around to keep the illusion of warmth,
which is great because they have to expend blood to do so.
If you are unfortunate enough to be dating a vampire, hold a mirror in front of their face while they sleep and see if they retain their warmth.
then promptly stake them in their sleep if they fail the test.
yes it might be a vampire or it might be a biomech.
Either way a themite grenade deals with both.
But then again these methods of vampire detection are only useful if you ALREADY know about them.
Which if you havn't been brought into the circle or had encounters with them icly , you won't
but its useful tricks for the few that do know of their existance. |
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| Aegyptia Elvehjem |
| Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 10:52 am Post subject: |
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My vampire breaths, has a heart beat and does everything same as a human, in fact, the only thing different really is in what she eats and that she has an extremely good immune system and slightly heightened strength. She is only very pale when she is sick or has not fed in some time. The things you list are mostly horror movie stereotypes like saying vampires are effected by religious objects...some are, I'm sure, but some of us prefer to play a more realistic human grounded version.
But humanistic version or not, the breath thing, most vampires don't need to breath, does not mean they can't breath. All the muscles are still there, you seem to be trying to say they are incapable of taking breath into their lungs, which is incorrect in my opinion, they can take it in, but their body simply will not use it. My vampire does breath unconsciously same as humans, her heart beats and pumps the blood and her body retains heat as well, plus I doubt it would take very much blood expendenture, no more than it would for humans who have to eat to sustain themselves in order to function properly.
At any rate, I take each character as an individual and discover who and what they are through roleplay. I find it to be, not only much more fun, but also just more respectful of the role player. When we get too much into trying to define other people's characters for them, rather than concentrating on defining our own, we start to get on shaky ground. The Breed needs to establish certain rules to put a lid on god moding and Chandra is doing an excellent job, plus a hard one, but that is a different issue, there are still many types of vamps that play well within the sim rules which is why she has made a special group for all types.
| Charles Noble wrote: |
SCENT
Well its not what vampires smell of
but what they don't smell of
they don't smell of
pheromones
sweat
fresh carbon dioxide..
stale carbon dioxide from the air is different from fresh carbon dioxide generated by a pair of functioning lungs as vampires only pretend to breathe and don't actually breath a keen nose would detect that.If it knew to flag that. |
Since a vampire does not need oxygen then they would simply breath out the same air they breathed in, there would be no heightening of the carbon content at all, so it would smell as reg air, not stale anything.
| Charles Noble wrote: |
[A biomech the same cept probablly smells of more mechanical smells in adition.. grease, oil, you know the sort and if you have keen smell due to some canine influence its likely you also have keen hearing too.
SOUND
if you are in a quite enough place you might notice the absence of heat beat and actual sound of breath exhalation.
As they don't actually breathe or exhale their voice can only carry on the air in front of them or in their mouths. Probablly has that same "strained" quality to it as an asthmatic would but with out the wheeze or rasp. |
They can and do exhale, the same air they breath in, only uncycled by the bloodstream due to the fact it's all for show, so they can speak and seem to breath same as anyone else using the same muscles present in humans.
| Charles Noble wrote: |
[
NORMAL OBSERVATION
In cold places you might notice that some people leave breath vapor on the air and others dont. (the flush of life only makes the heart beat and the cheast rise and fall it can not however stimulate breath, and even if it did a vampire could not stand outside on a cold day trying to pass for human very long with out passing out from blood loss, the flush of life requires blood expenditure)) |
see previous statement
| Charles Noble wrote: |
[Failing that give someone you suspect of being a vampire a birthday cake on their birthday and ask them to blow the candle out....HAHAHAHHAHA
course a bigger clue might be the number of candles on the cake.
Hand over an Ice cold beer to a someone and watch the glass for any mist that appears on touch. They have no body heat ergo they remain the same temprature as room around them.
Cold hand skin or hand shake.
though of course some vampires mask this coldness by pumping blood around to keep the illusion of warmth,
which is great because they have to expend blood to do so. |
Much the same as humans expend calories to live normally, vampires expend blood, they are warmer inside, thus when they breath, the air is warmed and there will be condensation on the glass, at least with my vamp, I won't try to speak for other's characters. This function would not wear them unduly any more than it would for a human to function normally, breath and walk around.
| Charles Noble wrote: |
[If you are unfortunate enough to be dating a vampire, hold a mirror in front of their face while they sleep and see if they retain their warmth.
then promptly stake them in their sleep if they fail the test.
yes it might be a vampire or it might be a biomech.
Either way a themite grenade deals with both.
But then again these methods of vampire detection are only useful if you ALREADY know about them.
Which if you havn't been brought into the circle or had encounters with them icly , you won't
but its useful tricks for the few that do know of their existance. |
These hints are not useful at all if they are not true for the character, no offense meant, but it really is better to give everyone the courtesy of discovering truths about them in roleplay rather than trying to force blanket gothic horror movie stereotypes on them.
_________________
(Khepera Sutekh, aka Venom, inventor of orig. Synthnip©- accept no knockoffs! founder/leader of KAOS, twin sis of Chigaru) BIO!>Pera
...
Last edited by Aegyptia Elvehjem on Thu Jun 12, 2008 1:24 pm; edited 4 times in total |
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